There has been a great deal of controversy over the graduation address of Fairfax County school board member Abrar Omeish to the Justice High School in Falls Church on June 7th. In her remarks to the graduates, Omeish praised a teacher who made social activism part of her class and warned the graduates that they are going into a world filled with racism and white supremacy. However, what really struck an admittedly libertarian chord with me was the third danger that she warned about: “excessive individualism.” Like free speech, individualism is now being presented as a danger rather than a strength in our society.
Omeish is a strong speaker who impressively moved between English, Spanish, and Arabic in her address. However, many parents objected in Fairfax (where I live) to the content of the remarks. She labeled those who do not agree with the activism agenda as effectively opposing anti-racism values: “You understand that social justice is only political for those that can afford to ignore it. You understand that ‘neutral’ is another word for complicit. And you have made a choice to take a stand.” She encourage the students to remain activists and pursue “jihad” because “we struggle with human greed, racism, extreme versions of individualism and capitalism, white supremacy, growing wealth gaps, disease, climate crisis, extreme poverty amidst luxury and waste right next door. And the list goes on.”
As we have previously discussed, “jihad” in Arabic does not mean violent acts despite the common view of the term. It is a reference to good acts or public service. There is no basis to suggest that this speech was encouraging violent action. Rather, she declared “Every part of your being may scream in rage at the ways others have wronged you,” but “let compassion for your fellow human beings, not anger or rage — and believe me this is hard to do — fuel you.”
What stood out for me was the reference to “extreme versions of individualism.” There was a time when individualism was viewed as a core protection and value in our society. Now it is often denounced as a harmful value that resists more collective and communal priorities from fighting Covid-19 to racial justice.
For years, academics have lashed out at individualism as a barrier for public policy goals like health care. On study on the “excesses of individualism” concluded, for example, “Libertarian individualism has created political isolation and prevents the evolution of democratic decision making and real partnerships in healthcare.” The case against individualism has been made in books ranging from Robert N. Bellah’s book Habits of the Heart: Individualism and Commitment in American Life, Amitai Etzioni’s The Spirit of Community. Writers like Nick Romeo insist:
Radical individualism today retains this highly circumscribed conception of government’s role; the body politic – above all – serves to protect the safety and the property of the individual. This is exemplified in a line made popular by the US president Ronald Reagan: the nine most terrifying words in the English language are: ‘I’m from the government and I’m here to help.’ It is a radical philosophy that suggests the political collective should have no role beyond the protection of the individual.
The old view of “rugged individualism” has become reactionary individualism for those arguing for a new collective consciousness. The move against individualism brings to mind a quote from Pasternak’s Doctor Zhivago:
“The main misfortune, the root of all the evil to come, was the loss of confidence in the value of one’s own opinion. People imagined that it was out of date to follow their own moral sense, that they must all sing in chorus, and live by other people’s notions, notions that were being crammed down everybody’s throat.”
Few would argue that there is no value in collective action and policies. Individualism is not anarchy. The concern is that the attacks on individualism are coinciding with attacks on values like free speech. There is a movement to force adherence to accepted norms or values — and a corresponding intolerance for opposing views.
That is why the dire warning of Omeish for the young graduates to fear “excessive individualism” was so jarring for those of us who find believe that on certain rights, to paraphrase Oscar Wilde, nothing succeeds like excess.
Why speak 2 languages – or any other – other than English at a high school graduation in the USA??? The USA was AND IS a Judeo-Christian nation, so let’s hear it in English. And let’s hear plenty of USA patriotism. Forget the whining of those who would rather be somewhere else; let them MOVE there.
Thetennants1970 says,
“Forget the whining of those who would rather be somewhere else; let them MOVE there.”
You remind me of Archie Bunker, the lovable bigot, who often said,
“My country, right or wrong; love it or leave it.”
The Trumpists complain that the country is on the precipice and warn that unless Trump wins, the country is finished. Biden won. Trumpists failed to take the country back. I think it may be time for you to MOVE!
Jeff Silberman
What does being Judeo-Christian have to do with speaking English?
I thought that liberals/leftists/loonies like diversity? Diversity starts with individualism………….the right to be different.
Why do we continue to allow terrorists to have a microphone? Especially around our children.
Because our constitution allows it and they have just as much right to as you do. Being a Muslim is not being a terrorist. Christians can be terrorists too and they are allowed to have a microphone as well.
Svelaz says “Christians can be terrorists, too….”
LOL…….oh, yeah. Little old Southern Baptist Church ladies can terrorize a pew of misbehaving youths in a Sunday morning service, just by rolling up the church bulletin and tapping it on their heads. Oh the humanity!!!
Watch the documentary “Two Barns” if you want proof of what Svelaz says is true:
Jeff, the link you posted was to a private video that may not be viewed.
Let’s compare the behavior of Christians and the Left. Yes, of course, anyone of any religion may become a terrorist.
There have been tragic examples of Christian cults that brainwashed people, like the Branch Davidians and the “socialist utopia” against racism of Jonestown. Then there were the non-Christian cults like Heaven’s Gate. Christian Scientists believe they are aliens, their name is a misnomer. It is a New Age sect.
Generally, these cults kill themselves, although they have engaged in violence when authorities try to rescue members.
Are Christians out engaging in violence on a massive scale? Why, no. That would be Democrats, in the guise of BLM, Antifa, or just Leftist activists, out there looting, burning, rioting, thrown bricks through the windows of businesses struggling with a pandemic.
Are Mormons taking time out of bicycling on their missions to chuck bricks through business windows? Nope.
Was it Christians who seized city blocks of Seattle to form CHOP? Nope. Those were Democrats.
Now, there was one group of people who broke off from a Trump rally to break some windows and trespass onto the Capitol Building. They posed in Pelosi’s office. One of them wore a silly bison costume. One of them was shot while climbing in through a window, though she was unarmed and not threatening any violence. They should be prosecuted for any crimes they committed, such as trespassing and destruction of property (as in the window they broke.)
Yet are the Jan 6th trespassers treated the same as the rioters and looters who terrorized the country for nearly a year? Why, no. The Jan 6 participants rot in oubliettes with the book thrown at them. They are accused of sedition. Meanwhile, those who actually burned down buildings, police precincts, and occupied apartment buildings either are not charged, or they are diverted to a counseling program.
Now let’s compare Christians with Muslims for modern day terrorism. While there are examples of military dictatorships who consider themselves Christians, Islam is the religion most associated as a motivator for religious terrorism and violence. Boko Haram. Hamas. PLA. Al-Qaeda. ISIS/ISIL. Qutbism. Al-Mourabitoun. AQAP. AQIS. Hezbollah. Jemaah Islamiyah. Mojahedin-e-Khalq. Taliban. Tehrik-i-Taliban. Jaish-e-Mohammed. LeT.
These busy bees have wrecked carnage and misery.
Meanwhile, Democrats fantasize that Christians are terribly threatening. They think if a Christian serves as a Supreme Court Justice, The Handmaid’s Tale might come true. They look at the facts of the world, and they worry about Christians.
Do you know how you can tell which religion, Christians or Muslims, people are actually afraid of? See which religion they are more apt to insult. Are Democrats suing Muslim bakers for not make custom cakes for gay weddings or transgender themes? Nope. Interesting, since there are so many videos of Muslim bakeries saying they are not at all interested in making custom confections for those themes. Nope, they target Christians.
An artist can put a crucifix in a jar of urine, and call it art without fear. Do you think any artist would dare attempt this with a Koran? No? Why not? Would it be because the artist would promptly be beheaded?
There are plenty of moderate Muslims, especially in the US, who ignore all those Sword verses, and the parts about killing Jews behind every rock. But there is also a segment who got an anti-semite, pro terrrorist, like Ilhan Omar elected. In most Mulsim majority countries, apostasy is a capital offense. Women are subjugated in just about all Muslim majority nations. Honor killings are still allowed. Islam does have a problem with terrorism, violence, and the subjugation of women. All religions go through reform.
While it is indeed possible that any ambulatory human being of average intelligence and capacity may engage in violence or terrorist acts, there is no denying the facts of who are committing these acts in trends.
Karen,
Thanks for your reply.
I concede that the MSM is exaggerating the 1/6 riot as an “insurrection” and claiming that 5 people died as a result. On the other hand, Fox News and Trumpists are trying to Pooh-Pooh it and engaging in “whataboutism.” Turley is not weighing in on either side.
Try this link: https://youtu.be/f1DY7sUA-Y8
It’s only an hour long, and I would welcome your reaction. It’s very interesting how friendly neighbors can turn on their neighbors, and I think a fair-minded person would find it enlightening.
Jeff, I live in a rural area with satellite internet. This limits my available bandwidth. I’ll check the link out when I am out and have WiFi. Thanks for sending it.
My position on 1/6 is that the perpetrators should be prosecuted for any crimes committed, and that there should be one standard of justice for anyone. The point is that there is clearly a different standard of justice being applied to the Jan 6 trespassers, compared with those who looted and rioted for the past year.
I don’t think it’s the false logic of whataboutism. The disparity in justice is the problem. It seems like these people are going to get the electric chair for breaking a couple of windows and trespassing. The initial report that they murdered a Capitol Police Officer turned out to be untrue. They did wrong, and should be punished, but the punishment should fit the crime, and it should be applied to everyone.
But it’s not. It seems like Democrats who riot and loot and seize entire city blocks get away with it? And they get away with it specifically because they’re rioting in the name of a Democrat cause. They’re either not charged or diverted to counseling. The disparity of justice is a very serious problem, as is the failure to impose law and order in Blue Cities.
Most of the accusations about what happened on January 6th appear to have been wrong, misleading, or just confused due to the conflicting initial reports. It does not appear that it rose to the level of the civil unrest and violence that plunged entire cities into chaos and murder. The January 6th incident was overblown by the media for political purposes, while the year long riots and arson were minimized and excused, again, for political purposes. The former are still rotting in jail and will have the book, the bookcase, and the entire printing press thrown at them. The latter either were not charged, or diverted to counseling.
This disparity and inaccuracy is a problem, as it indicates a politically based criminal justice system, and a propaganda machine.
So many businesses went under due to those riots. There are businesses who still can’t operate in “George Floyd Square” and CHOP.
This is terrible. There should be one standard of law for everyone.
Turley has condemned the January 6th unrest, and he also remarked on Trump’s plausible culpability in a couple of blog posts, so I do think he’s weighed in at least on some points.
Hi Jeff:
I don’t have sufficient bandwidth to watch the entire documentary about the Jedwabne pogrom. It was part of the Nazi Holocaust in Poland, in WWII.
I’m not sure why you are referencing the Holocaust? Are you referring to the fact that so many millennials don’t know about the Holocaust, or even question its authenticity? There has been a severe drop in understanding the circumstances and carnage of WWII. The entire BDS, anti-Israel, and anti-semitic movement gaining such ground on the Left can also be taken as a symptom of the lack of education about the Holocaust, and the Jewish diaspora in general.
Parents need to teach their children about the Jewish diaspora, the Holocaust, the British Mandate, the breakup of the Ottoman Empire, and all the steps taken before the legal founding of Israel. There are many resources available for parents. They obviously can’t leave this to the public education system, which has skewed so far Left, with its anti-semitic problem.
Karen,
I suggested you watch the documentary about that Polish village to dispute your assertion “Are Christians out engaging in violence on a massive scale?“
In that village, 1600 Jews who had lived side-by-side their Christian neighbors for generations were forced into a barn and burned alive one afternoon. There were no Germans involved; the murderers were Christians.
The documentary attempts to explain how it is that neighbors can suddenly turn on neighbors when there is an absence of lawful restraint. No Christians who participated in that massacre were ever prosecuted after the war. It was not an isolated event in Polish villages. And not unlike Americans who try to downplay the sins of our past, the author of a book about this horrendous history of Christian persecution of Polish Jews was vilified and threatened in Poland. That was 75 years ago, but some of those villagers who were children at that time and interviewed in the documentary stated the Jews had it coming to them though most claimed that they were horrified at what happened, and some thankfully risked their own lives to hide and protect a few Jewish survivors.
Jeff, so you’re saying that the Nazis were a Christian religious terrorist organization? You do realize that this was during WWII, and that the Nazi Secret Police were involved, right?
You do realize that the reason that Israel was created was to deal with the centuries old Jewish diaspora, right? That persecution of Jews was widespread, although of course more deadly in the Middle East. Pashas would go off “hunting Jews” much like they would game. It’s the whole kill-every-Jew-hiding-behind-every-stone bit.
You are totally incorrect that there were “no Germans involved.” The German secret service were involved, and their military police are present. Poland has long denied cooperating with the Nazis, but they are full of it.
This area was also part of the German-Soviet boundary of 1939. There was a socialist Jewish Bund, but the Soviets arrested them, and nationalized their businesses. The Poles were angered that some Jewish people in that socialist organization had welcomed the Soviets. During the Soviet occupation, some Jewish people joined the local militias, and the ethnic Poles blamed the entire Jewish community.
The Polish National Party portrayed Polish Jews as Communist Soviet collaborators. When the Soviets left, they took savage revenge.
Anti-semitism plus revenge equalled a terrible massacre.
Karen you say, “Jeff, so you’re saying that the Nazis were a Christian religious terrorist organization? You do realize that this was during WWII, and that the Nazi Secret Police were involved, right?”
If you had been able to watch the whole documentary, you would have learned that in this village and others like it, there were no Germans involved. The pogrom was motivated by a millennium of Christian Jew-hatred. In fact, the Germans reported to their superiors how savage the Poles were against their Jewish neighbors.
I’m not denying your other points, but this documentary was notable because no Germans instigated this massacre or stood silently by. They were not around on that day. And as you well know, when Germans were involved in a massacre, they generally supervised the Christian Ukrainians who did the murderous work.
By the way, whereas Hitler and Himmler and other high-ranking Nazis may have been rejected Christianity in favor of medieval paganism, certainly the vast majority of the 3 million or so Nazis and the German Wehrmacht and population were “good” Christians.
Jeff, you said, “If you had been able to watch the whole documentary, you would have learned that in this village and others like it, there were no Germans involved.” If the documentary made this claim, then it was wrong. It was discovered that the German secret service was involved in the plot, and their military police were actually present. In addition, I have described one of the motivations being revenge against Jewish socialists who had collaborated with the Soviet occupiers. While only a relative minority participated, the Germans and the ethnic Poles spread rumors that the majority of Jews had worked with the Soviets.
I do agree with you, however, that many Christians did have a marked anti-semitism, for over a thousand years. Anti-semitism used to be the norm, globally. The Merchant of Venice and that pound of flesh had a marked anti-semitic tone. There was also prejudice against Catholics (or “Papists”) for hundreds of years in England and many other Protestant nations, including the US. In order to receive a commission into the British Royal Navy, you had to swear against the Pope. I can’t recall the exact terms of the oath. They would often drink “to the confusion of the Pope.” Also, the main target of the KKK, second to black people, were Catholics.
My statement stands. The Jedwabne pogrom was anti-semitism plus revenge = terrible massacre.
I have explained why so many German churches accepted the Nazi party, and why its tenets appealed to so many Germans at the beginning. The Nazi party platform is so remarkably like the modern Democrat Party that excerpts of Mein Kampf were submitted, and accepted, to a feminist journal. This supports the theory that A) there is little quality control in publications, and B) the Nazis got popular support by promising many of the same high benefits of the modern Left.
Certainly, any church or German person who supported the Nazi party at any time did so to their shame. But the party’s murder rate did not come out until it was well in control of government.
We often wonder how any people or religious organization could ever have succumbed to Nazi propaganda. Yet, today, public schools across America teach BLM tenets, mainly that white people are born oppressors, and are guilty by birth, and that the police are all racist. We just saw a series of commercials on Nickelodeon promoting LGBTQ, BLM, and other racist propaganda.
Many churches in the US also promote Leftist propaganda, including the fallacy that the country is institutionally racist against black people, and so is law enforcement.
So, perhaps it’s all happening again. Look how easy it is to convince millions of Americans that an entire race of people, in this case white people, are born bad. What fools.
Jeff, whether you agree with me or not, one of the drivers behind my passionate opposition to Democrats pushing prejudice against white people is because history has been quite clear on the end result of targeting one class or race as the scapegoat for all ills.
Apparently, your post about the Holocaust were in response to the thread where Sevalez said “Christians can be terrorists, too.” I will repeat what I said earlier. Any ambulatory human being of average capacity can commit crimes, engage in terrorism or violence. But my point stands that the threat of terrorism is not coming from the Christian community. People aren’t afraid they’ll be beheaded if they burn a Bible or depict Jesus in any form, let alone a derogatory one.
If you have to use the Holocaust as an example, then you clearly can’t find any widespread Christian terrorist network threatening the country. However, let’s revisit the Holocaust. While the Nazi’s Holocaust was not a Christian movement, there were churches that went along with the Nazi government. Do you know why? Because the National Socialist German Workers Party were preaching universal healthcare, free childcare, employment for all, a war on poverty, huge public spending to create government works projects, government childcare centers, youth camps, gun control including the total disarming of Jews.
The commonly used term “the one percent” was taken from Hitler. He blamed the Jews, who made up 1% of Germany’s population, for the country’s ills. He blamed them for being successful, and so he passed confiscatory taxes upon them. This was in the name of equity.
Then the country started boycotting Jewish owned businesses. It’s reminiscent of today’s cancel culture and BDS. You should note that boycotting Israel is quite common in Democrat circles.
Political dissidents would be targeted, and eventually just vanished.
In short, churches supported the Nazi regime for the same reasons that many Germans did. Hitler promised equity. He targeted a group of people to blame the country’s problems upon. He promised more equity, and a better way of living through big government.
Sound familiar? Because it should. Many people, and many churches, openly support the Left, which promises better living through big government, gun control, and it targets white people as the source of all ills.
Do you want to repeat history? You should know that every time socialism has been tried, it leads to human rights abuses. Millions of people have been murdered by socialist and communist regimes. Scandinavia is capitalist, not socialist, so don’t even go there.
If you don’t want history to repeat itself, then you should consider either distancing yourself from the Democrat Party, or advocating for change. Beware, though. The Left targets dissenters for punishment and impoverishment. You might lose your business or your job if you speak out.
Karen, you say: “But my point stands that the threat of terrorism is not coming from the Christian community.“
The Proud Boys, Michigan Militia, Oath Keepers, the Boogooloo Boys, the 3 percenters, etc., are all Christian warriors armed to the teeth and ready, willing and able to “take this country back” at the drop of a hat. Name me 2 similarly militarized Jewish groups? Ok, just one?
You say: “You should know that every time socialism has been tried, it leads to human rights abuses.”
The founding of socialist Israel led to human rights abuses and the slaughter of millions like socialist Nazi Germany and the U.S.S.R?
Your take on Hitler’s persecution of the Jews is a novel one. I have never heard that the pursuit of “equity” was a cause of the Holocaust. Where did you read this? Please cite a reference.
Like I said elsewhere, you and I have polarized world views. You fear the Left will repeat a Holocaust whereas I fear the Trumpists could (though I seriously doubt it). Unfortunately, our differences cannot be bridged. It’s sad, but true. I guess that’s why our mothers instructed us never to talk politics with strangers! How’s the weather where you are?
Karen,
I have since read the Wikipedia on Jedwabne, and it seems there is a lot of controversy over the role of the German police- it seems they could have been passive onlookers who gave their consent, but the bottom line is that the Poles did the murdering of their Jewish neighbors because they were “Christ killers.” In fact, the documentary claims that the Jews being led away begged the local priest to intercede, but he refused. Presumably, he could have put a halt to the slaughter. Yes, it was partially due to resentment since many Jews were shopkeepers who had extended credit to their Gentile neighbors who were often in debt. After the massacre, the Poles took possession of all the abandoned property.
It’s a minor point, the KKK probably hated Jews even more than blacks. They tolerated blacks as long as they stayed in their place, but Jews? There was no place for them at all.
You say: “Yet, today, public schools across America teach BLM tenets, mainly that white people are born oppressors, and are guilty by birth, and that the police are all racist.”
If what you say is true, it would be horrendous, but I don’t believe it is so. To me, it sounds like Fox News/Newsmax/OAN/Blaze TV propaganda. I’m not buying it. These are gross mischaracterizations designed to engender hatred of Liberals.
I certainly don’t believe these statements. I’d have to see concrete evidence that this is the curricula of public schools not some tweet by some Leftist seeking attention.
You say: “So, perhaps it’s all happening again. Look how easy it is to convince millions of Americans that an entire race of people, in this case white people, are born bad. What fools.”
Again I don’t believe that white people are born bad. No *educated* and reasonably intelligent person would. Anyone who thinks otherwise should be shamed, shunned and ostracized from civil society. Maybe I am sheltered from people who hold such attitudes, but I don’t know anyone nor would I want to know anyone who held such beliefs. The kinds of people you are describing are completely foreign to me.
Jeff:
You said, “The Proud Boys, Michigan Militia, Oath Keepers, the Boogooloo Boys, the 3 percenters, etc., are all Christian warriors armed to the teeth and ready, willing and able to “take this country back” at the drop of a hat. Name me 2 similarly militarized Jewish groups? Ok, just one?”
The groups that you mentioned are not Christian organizations. To be honest, the Christians who never seem to cause trouble are the Mormons.
If a Muslim robs someone, and was not motivated by religion, then his religion is immaterial to the crime.
I would argue that the Nazis were not “good Christians.” That should be obvious. Nazism was not a Christian movement, although plenty of Christians participated, to their shame.
Israel is a capitalist country with a lot of social benefits. Under a socialist economy, making a profit is illegal. Industries are nationalized. The means of production are owned by the state. Its end goal is communism, under which private property is illegal.
So, no, Israel is not a socialist country.
What I find interesting is how Democrats keep holding up capitalist countries as examples of what socialism can accomplish. Take Scandinavia, for example. Their prime ministers have had to inform the US that they are capitalist; they are not socialist, and to please stop using them as an example of socialism. They have stricter immigration laws than us. The poor pay more in taxes than us.
Democrats want to make changes similar to Venezuela, but expect the same result as capitalist Scandinavia.
Now, I will absolutely grant you that there have been capitalist countries that experimented with some socialist aspects, without having a socialist economy. They quickly ran out of money and backed off from those experiments.
Even the CCP had to admit that it needed capitalism. There used to be sayings about children starving in Chine. By allowing at least some capitalism, China made tremendous financial gains. Of course, capitalism is only as just as the system upon which it is practiced. There are few individual rights in Communist China, so there is plenty of abuse of workers under this regime. Capitalism, in a republic with strong individual rights, is the freest, most fair economic system available.
You might find this article on the socialism experiment in Israel interesting.
https://fee.org/articles/israel-the-road-from-socialism/
What I find both tragic and ironic is that this polarization in politics has come about because both sides sincerely believe that the other will cause massive harm to the country. Both sides think the other will usher in the next dystopian totalitarian regime.
Yet, it is the Left that seeks to give government more power, and erode individual rights. You can’t even abstain from custom frosting a particular cake message or you will be threatened with poverty. It is the Left that judges everyone based on race, while the right thinks we should judge on character. Kids are coming home from school thinking they are bad because of their white skin color, and kids are no longer playing with everyone regardless of skin color. Kids are segregating on the playground due to the Democrat teachings.
Oh, and by the way, “Trumpist” is similar to “Libtard”, pejoratives that are quite impolite. This is why I don’t use such terms with anyone. You have otherwise been very polite to me, which I appreciate. I wish more people could have such conversations with those who disagree with them.
As for the weather here, it’s an oven. There is a family of crows who keep languishing on my front porch to take advantage of the shade. I’ve been filling the various water bowls I leave out for the birds and wildlife regularly, and keep them in the shade. Some of my horses inexplicably won’t stand in the shade. I’ve set ice out for my poor chickens.
It’s also rattler weather. We have found 5 rattle snakes in our property in the past week. My kid found 3 of them, which is giving me gray hair.
Jeff, you asked about Hitler’s promises to the German people:
http://schneidersgarden.weebly.com/blog/hitlers-promises-to-germany
The poster reads: “In 8 months 2 1/4 million of your fellow countrymen were brought work and bread. The class struggle and its parties are eliminated. Bolshevism is smashed. Provincialism is vanquished. A Reich of order and cleanliness has begun. One people. One Reich. One Leader. That is what is found under Hitler’s rules. Hitler wants: Equality of rights and Peace and Honor. Germany’s fate is also YOUR honor. Germany’s fate is also YOUR fate! Unanimous with YES! Vote for the Reichstag: Adolf Hitler and his Believers!”
“The people of Germany heard what they wanted to hear and ignored the violence of the Nazi party. Hitler blamed Germany’s problems on the “corrupt” politicians, communists, and Jews. He told Germany that if they got rid of them, all of Germany’s problems would vanish and the whole country would improve. Many people in Germany protested Hitler’s ideas and reasoning. They put blame on him for all of Germany’s problems. The people that did disagree with Hitler were faced with violence. Many were forced to leave the country to save their lives.”
Look at how the Left in the US seeks to destroy dissenters.
Hitler’s rhetoric was that the Jews were taking over the country. In response to the centuries old diaspora and pervasive anti-semitism, many Jews were entrepreneurs. It was more difficult to find work than to work for yourself, in some scenarios.
Hitler proclaimed how unfair it was that the 1% owned so much. He claimed it was unfair that 1% of the population made up 30% of the lawyers. So he wiped them out.
He used much of the same rhetoric that we see today. It is unfair to be successful. The rich became so at your expense. The 1% own too much. etc.
https://www.facinghistory.org/holocaust-and-human-behavior/chapter-5/hitlers-first-radio-address
But the misery of our people is terrible! The starving industrial proletariat [working class] have become unemployed in their millions, while the whole middle and artisan class have been made paupers. If the German farmer also is involved in this collapse we shall be faced with a catastrophe of vast proportions. For in that case, there will collapse not only a Reich, but also a 2000-year-old inheritance of the highest works of human culture and civilization…
The National Government will carry out the great task of reorganizing our national economy with two big Four-Year Plans:
Saving the German farmer so that the nation’s food supply and thus the life of the nation shall be secured.
Saving the German worker by a massive and comprehensive attack on unemployment.
In fourteen years the November parties have ruined the German farmer. In fourteen years they created an army of millions of unemployed. The National Government will carry out the following plan with iron resolution and dogged perseverance. Within four years the German farmer must be saved from pauperism. Within four years unemployment must be completely overcome . . .
. . . Our concern to provide daily bread will be equally a concern for the fulfillment of the responsibilities of society to those who are old and sick. The best safeguard against any experiment which might endanger the currency lies in economical administration, the promotion of work, and the preservation of agriculture, as well as in the use of individual initiative.”
Karen says, “The groups that you mentioned are not Christian organizations. To be honest, the Christians who never seem to cause trouble are the Mormons.
If a Muslim robs someone, and was not motivated by religion, then his religion is immaterial to the crime.”
By the same token, if a dictator like Hitler, Stalin or Mao murders millions, and was not motivated by the tenets of socialism, then socialism is immaterial to the crime. And yet the Right criticizes socialism because it invariably causes genocide. Nonsense. I am not a socialist. Most, if not all, governments have both socialism and capitalism in varying degrees. Economics should not become a rallying cry to demonize another.
You say, “I would argue that the Nazis were not “good Christians.”
I agree, but the problem is that the Germans/Nazis believed that they were being good Christians and justified their hatred of Jews, Gypsies and other life not worthy of living as not inconsistent with their Christian faith. What good is Christianity if it does not prevent this sort of murderous mindset or indifference to murder on a massive scale albeit with too few exceptions?
You say, “What I find both tragic and ironic is that this polarization in politics has come about because both sides sincerely believe that the other will cause massive harm to the country. Both sides think the other will usher in the next dystopian totalitarian regime.”
I agree. Unfortunately, demagogues on both sides of the political spectrum use such gross hyperbole to demonize the other and to motivate their side to get out the vote. There is no incentive to be circumspect and fair-minded in political discourse.
You say, “Yet, it is the Left that seeks to give government more power, and erode individual rights. You can’t even abstain from custom frosting a particular cake message or you will be threatened with poverty. It is the Left that judges everyone based on race, while the Right thinks we should judge on character.”
These are just the kinds of gross overstatements which divide the country which polarization you just stated you find “tragic.” So give it a rest. I’m too well educated to be swayed by such bogus narratives.
You say, “You have otherwise been very polite to me, which I appreciate. I wish more people could have such conversations with those who disagree with them.”
I want to continue chatting with you, but please do not not continue to repeat the narratives demonizing the Left which are heard on Fox News and talk radio, e.g., “look at how the Left in the US seeks to destroy dissenters.” We are not trying to destroy dissenters. We are voicing our opposition to Trumpism and all the lies associated with it. The fact that a great many REPUTABLE Republicans with UNIMPEACHABLE conservative credentials not the least of which- Liz Cheney, Paul Ryan and George Will- all agree that Trump is a damnable liar is proof that this is true. You have as much chance to convince me to hate my liberalism as you do to convince me to convert to Christianity. No offense.
Jeff Silberman
Jeff, you said, “I have since read the Wikipedia on Jedwabne, and it seems there is a lot of controversy over the role of the German police- it seems they could have been passive onlookers who gave their consent, but the bottom line is that the Poles did the murdering of their Jewish neighbors because they were “Christ killers.””
You said the Germans weren’t there. Apparently, they were, although you dispute whether they played an active role, or were just cheering from the sidelines.
You said the Poles killed the Jews because they were “Christ killers.” Why did they kill them all on that particular day, and not on any other day? What changed? Could it be…1)the Nazi presence and their stated goal of killing all the Jews 2) the well documented belief that a majority of the Jews collaborated with the Soviet occupiers, even though it was only a minority, 3) well documented attempts of ethnic Pole former Soviet collaborators who were trying to ingratiate themselves and regain their good names PLUS 4) centuries of anti-semitism?
There was a match that lit the tinder. You don’t just murder men, women, and children in a barn, ignoring their death screams, because of the same prejudice that’s been there for generations in Europe. Something was the trigger, the crisis point, that turned the town into bloodthirsty mass murderers.
I agree with you that ethnic Poles did the killing, regardless of the presence or participation of the German Nazis.
I have remarked before that Churches accepted Nazi propaganda, and supported the regime. I have also drawn parallels to the far Left politicization of many Churches today. Entire denominations participate in BDS, for example.
It has been said that the Pope refused to condemn the brutalization of Jews, because he observed that such protests led to more attacks on Jews. There is fiery debate about whether he looked the other way.
What is not widely known, however, is this:
“In Hungary, an estimated 80,000 baptismal certificates were issued by Church authorities to Jews. In other areas of Eastern Europe the Vatican escape network (organised via Bulgaria by the Nuncio Roncalli – later John XXIII) has impressed those writers who have studied the subject, with the effectiveness of the Church’s rescue operation. David Herstig concludes his book on the subject thus:
“Those rescued by Pius are today living all over the world. There went to Israel alone from Romania 360,000 to the year 1965.”
The vindication of Pius XII has been established principally by Jewish writers and from Israeli archives. It is now established that the Pope supervised a rescue network which saved 860,000 Jewish lives – more than all the international agencies put together.
After the war the Chief Rabbi of Israel thanked Pius XII for what he had done. The Chief Rabbi of Rome went one step further. He became a Catholic. He took the name Eugenio.”
https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/860-000-lives-saved-the-truth-about-pius-xii-and-the-jews
Karen says: “There was a match that lit the tinder. You don’t just murder men, women, and children in a barn, ignoring their death screams, because of the same prejudice that’s been there for generations in Europe. Something was the trigger, the crisis point, that turned the town into bloodthirsty mass murderers.”
That was the mystery attempted to be explained by the documentary. And there was no good answer. The survivors did not provide an answer. It seems that the absence of any repercussions by the German military police was all that was needed to unleash the hatred that had been boiling under the surface for a variety of reasons.
I don’t understand why the village Priests and/or the good Christians did not rally around their Jewish neighbors to persuade their friends and relatives to stop the senseless slaughter.
You criticize the Left which supports BDS. I support the existence of Israel as well as BDS. People should put their money where their mouth is. Those two views are not inconsistent. Calling someone an anti-Semite for supporting BDS is not unlike calling someone a racist for wanting to limit immigration. Both accusations are indefensible.
As far as Pius XII is concerned, that is a very complicated and highly debated matter. But the jury is still out on that question because not all the Vatican archives during the war have been released. Time will tell when they are.
Jeff Silberman
Jeff:
You wrote, “You say: “Yet, today, public schools across America teach BLM tenets, mainly that white people are born oppressors, and are guilty by birth, and that the police are all racist.”
If what you say is true, it would be horrendous, but I don’t believe it is so. To me, it sounds like Fox News/Newsmax/OAN/Blaze TV propaganda. I’m not buying it. These are gross mischaracterizations designed to engender hatred of Liberals.
I certainly don’t believe these statements. I’d have to see concrete evidence that this is the curricula of public schools not some tweet by some Leftist seeking attention.”
Will you please look into this? Take the time to research. Simply not believing it, based on faith, when this much harm is being done, is not responsible, as this affects children. While you are at it, you can also research why so many historians call the 1619 Project completely inaccurate. You can learn how BLM has been lying about the motivation behind police use of force, and which instances were justified.
I am a mother of an 11 year old in Deep Blue CA. We are living this.
You can find excerpts of CRT-based curriculum online. If you live in a Blue State, you can go to your local elementary, middle, and high schools and ask to see curriculum that teaches race issues to students.
Children are being taught that whites kidnapped black slaves. They are only taught about white slave owners. They are not taught that African tribes kidnapped or captured rival tribes, and sold them to slave traders. They are not taught that the Barbary slavers captured more black slaves than Europeans did, or that they castrated many of the men. Nor are they taught about the Barbary slavers targeting Europeans for slaves, and that the name Slav, actually means “slave”. They don’t learn that Mauritius was the last nation to ban slavery, in the 1980s, or how common slavery is today on the African continent. They don’t know Native Americans kept slaves, especially sex slaves.
They would have absolutely no idea that an immigrant from Africa, today, might have owned slaves in his lifetime.
Children are taught that whites enslaved blacks. Whites were oppressors and blacks victims. This is not at all accurate, nor does it reflect that slavery was ubiquitous in human history. They certainly are not taught that the West was at the forefront of banning this ubiquitous evil.
https://nypost.com/2016/07/01/elite-k-8-school-teaches-white-students-theyre-born-racist/
“An elite Manhattan school is teaching white students as young as 6 that they’re born racist and should feel guilty benefiting from “white privilege,” while heaping praise and cupcakes on their black peers.
Administrators at the Bank Street School for Children on the Upper West Side claim it’s a novel approach to fighting discrimination, and that several other private New York schools are doing it, but even liberal parents aren’t buying it.
A slide from the Bank School shows the different goals for white children (right) and “kids of color” (left).
They complain the K-8 school of 430 kids is separating whites in classes where they’re made to feel awful about their “whiteness,” and all the “kids of color” in other rooms where they’re taught to feel proud about their race and are rewarded with treats and other privileges.
“Ever since Ferguson, the school has been increasing anti-white propaganda in its curriculum,” said a parent who requested anonymity because he has children currently enrolled in the school.
Bank Street has created a “dedicated space” in the school for “kids of color,” where they’re “embraced” by minority instructors and encouraged to “voice their feelings” and “share experiences about being a kid of color,” according to school presentation slides obtained by The Post.
Meanwhile, white kids are herded into separate classrooms and taught to raise their “awareness of the prevalence of Whiteness and privilege,” challenge “notions of colorblindness (and) assumptions of ‘normal,’ ‘good,’ and ‘American’” and “understand and own European ancestry and see the tie to privilege.”
The same slides point out that a number of leading private schools across the country also have segregated students by “race-based affinity groups.” It lists several in New York, including Riverdale Country School, Brooklyn Friends School, The Cathedral School, The Calhoun School, Ethical Culture Fieldston School, and Little Red School House and Elisabeth Irwin High School.
‘One hundred percent of the curriculum is what whites have done to other races. They offer nothing that would balance the story.’
– Anonymous Bank Street parent
Under Bank Street’s “Racial Justice and Advocacy” curriculum, parents say, teachers push white kids to grapple with America’s history of racism. Then they indoctrinate them into thinking “systemic racism” still exists, and that they’re part of the problem and must hold themselves accountable even for acts of racism committed by others.
“One hundred percent of the curriculum is what whites have done to other races,” said another Bank Street parent. “They offer nothing that would balance the story.””
Karen says: “Will you please look into this? Take the time to research. Simply not believing it, based on faith, when this much harm is being done, is not responsible, as this affects children. While you are at it, you can also research why so many historians call the 1619 Project completely inaccurate. You can learn how BLM has been lying about the motivation behind police use of force, and which instances were justified.”
Honestly, I don’t have the time nor the inclination to invest my limited time researching these claims of yours. I hear these accusations on Fox News and talk radio, but I don’t trust these sources because they have lied about many things. They state that Trump is not a liar. They believe that Liberalism is a mental disease. They believe that Democrats hate America. They believe that the Left are Marxists.
So, you will forgive me that I refuse to believe Rightwing media. When I hear the media I trust repeat what you believe, I will then believe it. I’m sure that is not a satisfactory answer, but that is the best I can do on this issue.
Jeff Silberman
Karen………as always, excellent comment.
OT…….I loved your comment about the ex racehorse you bought, who had become attached to a goat . Such a cute story. I told our grandsons, who have a few horses. The older one said he had heard that goats calm horses?
Hi Cindy:
Horses are herd animals, and they develop very tight friendships with their favorite buddies. It can even rise to the level of a problem with “buddy sour” or “barn sour” horses, who become nervous or upset if they are ridden away from their best friend. Or they whiny loudly if their bestie goes out for a ride, leaving them behind. They are very emotional animals.
This becomes a significant problem for race horses. These are very young horses who barely tolerate a rider. Many horses aren’t even backed at the age that TBs race. They are bred to be sensitive, high strung, and fast. During the racing circuit, they go from track to track, often stabled next to different horses. They can’t just get settled anywhere during racing season. They can’t get too attached to their stablemates, who might not go to the next track. So some trainers give their horses their own pet goats, especially if they exhibit anxiety, weight loss, or symptoms of gastric ulcers. It’s not that the goat itself calms the horse; it’s that it’s their goat who is always stalled with them. No matter what track they go to, they have their goat buddy. When they roll into a new training stable or track, their goat is with them.
It’s kind of like going to a new school but you’ve got your best friend with you, so you know at least one person.
Thank you, Karen….I’ll read this to our boys.
Karen says: “It seems like these people are going to get the electric chair for breaking a couple of windows and trespassing.”
Karen, it’s just exactly this kind of Trumpian hyperbole which makes it impossible to have a rational conversation with you. I know you don’t literally believe that the rioters will be executed. So why say it? You suppose that such a gross exaggeration will persuade me? Quite the opposite. When I hear such preposterous remarks, I dismiss the speaker out of hand as someone not worth engaging.
I am not aware that the BLM/Antifa rioters are being treated less severely than the 1/6 rioters. If so, I condemn it. Everyone should be treated equally under the law; and that is what I presume is the case unless I see evidence to rebut it. I know that Fox News promotes that narrative, but then, I would not trust Fox to give me the time of day.
I agree that the MSM will sensationalize a story for ratings. Both sides need to stop exaggerating! The question is which side is exaggerating more absurdly. Has Turley observed a disparity in treatment between 1/6 rioters and BLM/Antifa rioters? If not, I think that is damn good evidence that it is a Fox News “victimhood” narrative. I would trust Turley, not Fox.
Karen,
I confess that my statement that I would not trust Fox to give me the time of day is an exaggeration. I would trust it to give me the time of day, but honestly, not much else if it came from Hannity, Carlson, Pirro, Levin or Ingraham.
Jeff, I said, “It seems like these people are going to get the electric chair for breaking a couple of windows and trespassing” to point out that they are being seriously charged, denied bail, in “restrictive housing”, which seems to be a euphemism for solitary confinement. This is in direct and shocking contrast to Democrat rioters who were either not charged or diverted to counseling for rioting, looting, burning down a police precinct, burning buildings, launching bombs at federal buildings, and seizing entire city blocks.
Do you agree with my point that there is a gross disparity of treatment? One crime is exaggerated, while the others are ignored, excused, and diminished?
I’ve never said the law should not applied to the January 6th protestors. I’ve said they should be charged for the laws they broke.
This should apply to everyone, no?
You said, “I am not aware that the BLM/Antifa rioters are being treated less severely than the 1/6 rioters. If so, I condemn it.” I love it when people like us who disagree politically find common ground. I did not know you had not read about this disparity.
Let me provide a few links:
https://thepostmillennial.com/seattle-will-not-prosecute-protestors-for-criminal-acts
“The DA’s office has received 37 misdemeanor cases so far from the latest civil unrest in Seattle. Many are for obstructing police, but the list includes half a dozen assaults, theft, reckless endangerment and attempted property damage. Holmes said he hopes to refer these protesters to “Choose 180, a restorative justice program with a proven track record.”
However, Choose 180 is one of the groups currently occupying the Capitol Hill Occupied Protest (CHOP) and negotiating with the city for terms including barriers to extend the occupation.”
Seattle City Attorney Pete Holmes said in a statement:
After two weeks of anguished demonstrations over the murder of George Floyd and the killing of other unarmed black men by police, it is plain to me that peaceful protestors should not be prosecuted despite having been arrested during events that have sometimes devolved into violent and destructive confrontations with Seattle police and supporting law enforcement agencies…”
Over the last week, my office has been talking with Sean Goode, the Executive Director of CHOOSE 180, an incredibly successful non-profit diversion program my office partners with to redirect young people ages 18-24 to a community-based and community-run workshop.?It’s a place where young adults are treated with respect and empathy, and engaged with on a truly human level. If a young person is arrested and engages in the CHOOSE 180 workshop, my office will not file a criminal charge.”
https://jonathanturley.org/2021/05/26/a-political-problem-new-mexico-district-attorney-gives-probation-to-all-rioters/comment-page-1/
And here is a list of the charges against the January 6th protestors. Notice that there’s no diversion to a counseling program. No statements about not charging angry young people who broke off from a peaceful protest. Mind you, Democrat riots have thrown bombs at federal buildings, destroyed police cars, assaulted cops, burned down an entire police precinct and its contents, perhaps damaging criminal investigations, and they’ve seized entire city blocks in an act of sedition. Many had guns, knives, hammers, and other weapons. But they get counseling. The people who assaulted Kyle Rittenhouse were never charged. People who assaulted diners in restaurants and terrorized them to get them to chant “Black Lives Matter” were not charged.
https://www.usatoday.com/storytelling/capitol-riot-mob-arrests/
Charges:
Conspiracy;
obstructing an official proceeding;
unlawful entry on restricted building or grounds;
tampering with documents or proceedings
Assaulting,
resisting or impeding certain officers;
knowingly entering or remaining in any restricted building or grounds without lawful authority;
disorderly and disruptive conduct in a restricted building or grounds; obstruction of law enforcement during a civil disorder;
acts of physical violence in any of the Capitol buildings or grounds
Parading (!!!)demonstrating or picketing in a Capitol building (Did you know it was illegal to parade in a Capitol building? I didn’t.)
unlawful posession of a dangerous weapon on Capitol grounds
Entering or remaining in restricted building or grounds
physical violence on Capitol grounds
civil disorder
robbery of personal property of the United States
commit or attempt any act to obstruct, impede or interfere with law enforcement in performance of his official duties
Note that charges of assaults or obstruction on police officers include when a guy threw a barricade to the side, without hitting any officer.
Most of these people are charged with “conspiracy”, unlawful entry on restricted building, parading inside a Capitol building, and disorderly conduct. That’s because almost all of them came inside and just milled around, taking photos.
Yet many were in solitary confinement, denied bail. No counseling. No DA proclaiming he understood that people get upset and do stupid things…like seize a couple of city blocks to create an “autonomous zone”, essentially trapping residents and business owners inside.
Nope. It’s into an oubliette with them.
I hope this explains why I vehemently object to the different standards of justice applied. There are business owners who lost everything because of Democrat riots. There are businesses that still cannot open because of BLM actions at “George Floyd Square.” They illegally put up barricades that prevent customers from shopping at those businesses. There are people homeless, jobless, and impoverished because of Democrat rioters who just got counseling.
All the January 6th fools did was break a couple of windows, mill around like cattle, and pose at Nancy Pelosi’s desk. They didn’t burn down anyone’s home or business. But activists have made quite a few of them lose their jobs, impoverishing these protestors who ran amuck.
It’s so frustrating how blind people are to the difference in violence, property damage, job losses, and even “autonomous zones” between the Jan 6th people and the Democrats who rioted for a year. People are absolutely blind to the disparity in crimes committed and how the perpetrators are treated.
Karen: “Democrat riots have thrown bombs at federal buildings, destroyed police cars, assaulted cops, burned down an entire police precinct and its contents, perhaps damaging criminal investigations, and they’ve seized entire city blocks in an act of sedition.”
DEMOCRATS? Um, I thought we were talking about Antifa thugs. They are more likely anarchists. I don’t call the Proud Boys, Michigan Militia, Oath Keepers, the Boogooloo Boys, etc., “Republicans.” I would call them Trumpists. There is a difference.
Karen,
It’s understandable that you have sympathy for the Trumpists who attached the Capitol since I presume you are a Trumpist. I am not, nor have I ever marched with BLM or any protest for that matter. I am as indifferent to Antifa as I am Trumpists. I do not concern myself with the criminal or civil repercussions of either group. I presume that both classes of rioters have competent defense counsel to protect their respective rights. It’s impossible for me to judge whether one side is getting favorable treatment without knowing ALL the facts on both sides including the statutory penalties for the alleged offenses, the mitigating circumstances, the plea bargains, the cooperation agreements, etc. One cannot make *blanket* generalizations about the treatment of the Left vs. the Right under these complicated factual and legal circumstances.
The bottom line is that I have faith in the defeat and state criminal justice system, by and large; it seems you don’t.
Jeff, you said, “DEMOCRATS? Um, I thought we were talking about Antifa thugs. They are more likely anarchists.” I completely agree with you that Antifa are thugs when they engage in violent behavior. I used to think they were anarchists, but have changed my mind over time. They don’t want the abolition of government. They want to a far Left government.
What I realized that the rioters, looters, and arsonists terrorizing our nation for about a year have in common is that they vote Democrat. I used to vote either way, Democrat or Republican, although more right than left. The patriotic urging to “ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country” was an inspirational moment by JFK. Democrats and Republicans used to agree that illegal immigration was bad for the country. They both used to love the United States. They just disagreed about the role of a central government, and about taxation. That time is over. Maybe one day we will return to sharing so much common ground. But until then…
The Democrat Party main rhetoric is that white people are born bad, men are bad, and that the US is a patriarchy rife with systemic racism.
The public education of the US reflects the Democrat Party, for the most part. Democrats write curriculum. Democrats incorporate CRT in classrooms. They have long employed racist identity politics, in which ones worth is evaluated based on skin color. They have been advocating for children suffering from gender dysphoria to medically transition. This is a euphemism for the castration and sterilization of children. Multiple studies, over decades, have indicated that the vast majority of such children outgrow their dysphoria and accept their bodies.
This is all coming from the Left. They are voting Democrat in such numbers that the party has swerved far Left to appease them. They have even voted for multiple, open anti-semites in Congress. Democrats kept calling Trump an anti-semite, claiming that they knew his innermost thoughts. It was patently absurd. The man has a Jewish family, was tight with Netanyahu, and a staunch supporter of Israel. When so many politicians fought with him over finally fulfilling the US promise to move the embassy to Jerusalem, Trump didn’t care. Yet he was called an anti-semite, in spite of evidence to the contrary. The Squad (or the Hamas Squad), openly makes anti-semitic statements. They’ve called Israel an apartheid state, accused them of war crimes for defending themselves against constant terrorist attacks. Hamas used Al-Aqsa as a base to store weapons, and from which to throw rocks at praying Jews, yet Jews are the bad guys in this scenario.
Jeff, just admit it. If Republican voters were out there burning down police precincts, looting, rioting, smashing businesses, throwing bombs at federal buildings, threatening people in restaurants, and seizing entire city blocks for their own autonomous zones, then the media would have been screaming about the entire Republican Party having a problem. Look at how they’ve reacted to Republican voters pushing their way into the Capitol Building to protest election fraud. They milled around, taking photos, and “illegally paraded” inside. They’re in solitary confinement, and the National Guard was called in for months.
If the places were switched, and it was Republicans, rather than BLM, Antifa, and all the other Democrat activists out there, you’d say we were in Gilead or make another dystopian comparison.
Jeff:
“Trumpist” is a slur for people who voted for Trump, i.e. voted Republican. Trump is not evil, though he is quite rude. There is a tremendous amount of propaganda spread about him which is easily disprovable.
Are any of the right wing groups that you speak of burning down cities or seizing entire city blocks? Are the media, and most Republican politicians excusing violence? Are they bailing out people who loot stores? Nope. But Democrats are. Racist identity politics, racist Critical Race Theory, constantly claiming that every police use of force against a black man is racist and refusing to admit when they’re wrong, misrepresenting the facts on police use of force to advance the falsehood that law enforcement is racist, defund the police, BLM, canceling those who don’t agree with them…that’s all mainstream Democrat. It’s reflective of the entire party as a whole.
Did you know how the Proud Boys was founded? Gavin McInnes knew a young man who had pretty much zero manly tendencies. He had absolutely no idea how to act manly or ask a girl out. He was a wall flower. So Gavin created Proud Boys, named ironically after a line from a Broadway musical song, where a mother is “proud of my boy.” It was a tongue in cheek club where their friends did the most cliche manly man activities possible to try to show this guy how to get in touch with his inner cave man. Women tend to be far more attracted to strong men who could build them a mansion if they ever crashed on a deserted island, than to a metrosexual in skinny jeans crying over a Hallmark commercial.
Soon after this, Gavin got fed up with the threats of physical violence he encountered each and every time he was an invited speaker at a university. If you’ve read this blog, then you should be aware that every time a conservative is invited to speak at most universities, they receive death threats, mobs form, and if they make it inside, they are screamed and shouted down to prevent the audience from hearing anything.
So his buddies at the Proud Boys started to run personal security for him. They would form a testosterone human barricade around Gavin, just to allow him to get inside the venue unmolested.
It became clear that Blue Cities would not allow law enforcement to defend homes and businesses from Antifa, who were left to literally run riot. After a point, vigilantism took hold. People took it into their own hands to protect communities from the thugs like Antifa. Proud Boys naturally branched out into this.
They are not racist. Something like 30% of their members are minorities. They are not Fascist, as they are not advocating for a powerful government with few individual rights. (It’s the Left that wants that scenario.)
The Proud Boys have become more violent, and the organization has attracted people who just want to fight. So it’s quite a bit different from the manly man drinking club of its roots. While its members have been guilty of fighting, much of what has been said about them is pure propaganda. Which is the trend.
I don’t advocate breaking the law, which means I don’t excuse PBs if and when its members break the law. But at least get the story straight. They are now a counter movement to Antifa, the latter of which calls anything capitalist fascist. Antifa is a misnomer, as it’s using fascist tactics, and is not fighting actual fascism at all.
Karen,
We ALL agree that everyone should be treated equally under the law- unfortunately, that is where the agreement ends. It’s all a matter of emphasis- whose narrative predominates.
The Right wants to claim the victimhood card away from the Left which admittedly has historically played it.
I am in no position to know which side is telling the WHOLE truth and NOTHING BUT the truth about the disparity in the treatment of Left vs Right rioters. The devil is in the details, and I don’t have the time nor the inclination to delve into them because I am not a reporter who gets paid to do so. I have to rely upon the sources of information which I have come to trust over the years. Since I cannot verify the information which is presented to me by Left or Right leaning news sources, I decide which outlet to trust by the process of elimination. If a news source makes a claim which is wildly exaggerated on its face, then I dismiss that source.
I cannot make this point by talking in terms of generalities. So let me give you some concrete examples. I monitor 3 hours of Fox News daily so I know of what I speak about the Right. Here are a couple of TV banner headlines to grab the attention of their viewers:
“Dems want to program Americans to live in Fear”
“Exposing the Radicals behind America’s Crime Wave”
“Obama returns to Help Stoke Racial Fire”
“Obama is Back to Divide America as Much as He Can”
I cannot trust or take seriously a news operation which promotes such prejudice against Liberals. If I believed such narratives, I would hate Liberals too! But these are not mere opinions- they are lies as far as I am concerned. So I don’t regard Fox as a news source. And this is why I resent Turley- who I would otherwise respect- for being employed and remaining silent when he knows full well that Fox is fueling the “age of rage” which he constantly laments in his articles.
Karen,
You said, “Democrats kept calling Trump an anti-semite, claiming that they knew his innermost thoughts. It was patently absurd. The man has a Jewish family, was tight with Netanyahu, and a staunch supporter of Israel.”
Republicans call liberal Jews “anti-semites” and “self-hating Jews,” so spare me your defense that Trump cannot be an anti-Semite just because he has a Jewish son-in-law! Trump has many faults, but being an anti-Semite is not one of them.
I don’t call anyone an anti-Semite of a racist since I cannot know their heart. I limit my complaint to people’s statements. People can make bigoted statements out of ignorance without being bigots themselves, e.g., the lovable bigot Archie Bunker!
As for your other comments and opinions, I have a very different view. I hear your view on talk radio and see it on Fox TV which is effectively talk radio on TV. For us to even begin to see eye-to-eye would require hours of face-to-face conversations with a few rounds of a social lubricant called alcohol. It cannot be achieved here.
But were we to meet, the very first question I would ask is: do you believe that Trump is a chronic and habitual liar? If you said, “no,” I would get up and leave because I would realize that I am not talking with a rational person.
Karen,
I have enjoyed our conversation. I hope that our interaction belies some on this blog who accuse me of being unwilling to answer direct questions and defend my opinions. I don’t run away from discussions. I just won’t suffer trolls (which you are not).
You say: “Trumpist” is a slur for people who voted for Trump, i.e. voted Republican. Trump is not evil, though he is quite rude.” I have stated elsewhere that I don’t use the word “Trumpist” as a pejorative. It’s just a shorthand for “Trump follower or defender.” I do not believe Trump is “evil,” but he is a chronic liar. Is that what you mean by his being “rude?”
As I have said to you elsewhere, all the Militia groups in the various States, the Christian Identity groups, and the Neo-Nazi/skinhead factions are geared up for a revolution. So, the Left have as much to fear from the Right as you perceive to fear from arsonist and brick throwing Antifa/BLM goons.
We will get nowhere if we define each other by trying to associate each other by pointing to the extremes of our respective ideologies. If we both denounce the extreme views of our sides, we may have more in common than we think. But it requires a willingness to put down the hatchet and become more circumspect in our dialogue. We need to disavow hyperbole in making our points and dismissing out of hand the opinions of our opponents. Turley is a good example. He makes it a point to presume that those who take issue with him are acting in good faith and that reasonable people can disagree. He is never strident though he attracts people on this blog who do not share his fair-mindedness. I criticize him for not disabusing people who post mischaracterizations of his legal opinions. He is doing a disservice as long as many of his readers are misinterpreting him when this blog enables him to clear up any mistaken conclusions with a word or two interjected into the comment section.
Jeff, you said, “Republicans call liberal Jews “anti-semites” and “self-hating Jews,” so spare me your defense that Trump cannot be an anti-Semite just because he has a Jewish son-in-law!”
Trump does not have prejudice against Jewish people. The evidence shows that he has been a strong supporter of Israel. He has no history of saying annoying like Ilhan Omar’s “It’s all about the Benjamins”.
One of my relatives called my branch of the family Neo Nazi supporters because of voting for Trump. The stupid woman actually thought Trump would send Death Vans for the Jews. This wasn’t hyperbole. She was actually terrified. The things she said to my sweet mother…my God, she was crazy.
Trump has Jewish family, friends, and business associates. He has no record of being anti-semitic.
Look at the Squad. They make blatant anti-semitic comments with regularity. They defend Hamas. No one has to contort themselves claiming to know what they really think. The anti-semitic accusations are based on what the Squad actually says.
Do you think that Trump accepted a Jewish son-in-law, supported his daughter’s conversion, moved the embassy to Jerusalem in spite of massive pressure not to do so, and had a great relationship with Netanyahu because he was secretly anti-semitic, and somehow plotting against the Jews? Because if so, he’s left it a bit late.
It doesn’t really matter what someone thinks, but rather what they do.
I do think Trump has a bad habit of hyperbole. Everything is “huge”, “greatest ever”, etc. He is self aggrandizing. Prone to exaggeration. I remember when Trump was first announced as the Republican candidate, I was upset. It took a while to win me over, in spite of his character flaws. But I was surprised at how often I agreed with his policies. Over and over again, the media mocked him for something that turned out to be true. Like the Wuhan BSL4 lab. So many times, I would hear an accusation, like the “fine people” remark, only to listen, for myself, to what he actually said, and to discover the media’s pants were on fire.
You shouldn’t take any journalist’s word for anything, at this point. We don’t have access to verify stories based on inside sources, but just about anything else can be verified.
My problem with the Democrat Party isn’t with the extremists shouting in subways. It’s with the fact that the party platform itself has veered so far Left as to incorporate extremist positions. Bill Maher has made some rather cutting remarks about the direction progressivism has taken.
Maybe one day things will adjust to the point that I can find much in common with the Democrat Party again, but we’re currently moving away from that point.
I have seen liberal Jews like Jeff most of my career…I have hired them and fired them but it had nothing to do with politics…they just did not do their job…and I had to fix what they broke…Jeff calls anyone who disagrees with him a troll and a liar…especially if you voted for Trump…now we are finding out in Georgia that 19,000 votes were illegally cast…enough to change the electoral votes to Trump…now we will look at other states votes…Biden lost the election…when elections can be stolen we do not have a country like the one I was raised in…now I’m sure Jeff will call me an anti-Semite too…I could care less…just like Dennis Prager says the far left will never debate a far right conservative…he has offered 10,000$ to debate anyone on the far left anywhere any time and they always refuse…why?…because they know they will look very stupid on TV!
1949 says: “I have seen liberal Jews like Jeff most of my career…I have hired them and fired them but it had nothing to do with politics…they just did not do their job…and I had to fix what they broke…”
That’s because Jews customarily don’t work with their hands as laborers. They make a living using their heads.
Good luck with the vote count. You are going to need it! Fox News and Turley have been utterly silent on the matter. Even Trump conceded he lost the other night on Hannity.
No, I will never call you an anti-Semite. Genuine anti-Semites usually self-identify and have no shame in stating openly their Jew-hatred, e.g., KKK members. At most, I will cite a statement as anti Semitic probably because it reinforces a negative stereotype out of sheer ignorance, e.g., Jews “control” Hollywood.
If you will notice, I am having an extensive and polite conversation with Karen S as well as Prairie Rose. We do not agree on many matters, but I have called neither a liar or a troll. I treat people with respect who likewise treat me so. I demand nothing more, but I will accept nothing less.
Jeff Silberman
Karen says;
“Trump does not have prejudice against Jewish people. The evidence shows that he has been a strong supporter of Israel. He has no history of saying annoying like Ilhan Omar’s “It’s all about the Benjamins”.
First of all, I have NEVER accused Trump of being an anti-Semite; I accuse him of being a chronic and habitual LIAR!
I agree that Omar’s *statement* about the “Benjamin’s” reinforced negative Jewish stereotypes not unlike Trump’s appearance before a Jewish association where he claimed that he “didn’t need their money” or words to that effect.
You say, “Look at the Squad. They make blatant anti-semitic comments with regularity. They defend Hamas. No one has to contort themselves claiming to know what they really think. The anti-semitic accusations are based on what the Squad actually says.”
If you wish me to respond to your accusations, you will have to be specific. I don’t deny that they have said some anti-Semitic statements just like Marjorie Taylor Green.
More importantly, we should not smear an entire political party because of a few bigoted statements by the fringes of the party. I hold a party responsible for such statements when they don’t DENOUNCE such untoward statements.
You say, “It took a while to win me over, in spite of his character flaws. But I was surprised at how often I agreed with his policies. Over and over again, the media mocked him for something that turned out to be true. Like the Wuhan BSL4 lab.”
The jury is still out on whether the virus originated from a lab. Trumpists (no offense) believe China deliberately released it! Even if it can be proven it leaked from a lab, it was an accident.
You say, “You shouldn’t take any journalist’s word for anything, at this point. We don’t have access to verify stories based on inside sources, but just about anything else can be verified.”
I agree. While it may be impossible to verify who is telling the truth, it is much easier to know when I am being lied to. And when my common sense tells me that, I no longer trust that source.
You say, “Bill Maher has made some rather cutting remarks about the direction progressivism has taken.”
You watch Bill Maher? Or just what you learn from Rightwing media? I watch Bill Maher, and he has far more negative things to say about the Right than his criticism of the Left.
The Left is not above criticism. Leftists are humans just like those on the Right, and therefore they are not immune to the same failing of ALL humans. I do not support all things Leftist. I just happen to believe that Trumpism and its cult of liars has greatly increased the polarization of this country because most Americans will not accept lying.
Karen,
That most recent unsigned anonymous statement was made by me. I apologize that I have not been able to post under my name of late, but sometimes I am not able.
Jeff Silberman
“I am not aware that the BLM/Antifa rioters are being treated less severely than the 1/6 rioters.”
Ignorance is no excuse. From local NBC affiliate in DC, June 10: “At least 39 defendants from the U.S. Capitol insurrection are being held in the Washington, D.C., jail, as they await trial, the News4 I-Team has learned.”
How many BLM looters have spent this time in jail? Pretrial?
Greg,
Ignorance is an excuse when I don’t care how many BLM rioters have spent time in jail. If I was their lawyer, I would care, but I’m not.
It’s interesting how JT is being attacked for writing a book and selling it on TV…if you are famous like JT and get an advance for a book you are required to sell the book…that’s capitalism…if I wrote a book nobody would read it…I am not famous…that is a question I get a kick out of asking people…other than the Bible…what was the book that changed your life most of all?…for me it was tom sawyer and huckleberry finn.
I’m not attacking Turley for writing a book and plugging it on Fox. I’m simply making an observation that he would be foolish to leave Fox until after it is published! I criticize him sullying his professional reputation by appearing on shows with talk show hosts that the great majority of his academic and legal colleagues consider hate-mongers. Which disgust could explain why Turley is preoccupied with alleging that there is a liberal conspiracy to purge conservative professors. He may be feeling the heat at George Washington law school for his association with Fox News which its faculty may hold no less in disrepute than it does Infowars.
You have to be living in a cave not to know that far left teachers now out number conservatives 17-1 at every grade from kindergarten to graduate school to post graduate school. That is not a conspiracy theory…that’s a fact!
Hjf,
Where did you get that 17-1 figure? Exactly 17-1 at every level? I find that hard to swallow even for cave dwellers.
I don’t doubt liberals outnumber conservative teachers, but that is no more a conspiracy than the fact that Dentists are vastly disproportionately Jewish as compared to their 3% of the general population!
Karen S = +1000 likes.
..agree! well said… especially folks who came to this country for a better life and then try to tear it down every which way…… while calling those who got here first & built it into greatness ‘racists……’